Jump to content
British Coin Forum - Predecimal.com

50 Years of RotographicCoinpublications.com A Rotographic Imprint. Price guide reference book publishers since 1959. Lots of books on coins, banknotes and medals. Please visit and like Coin Publications on Facebook for offers and updates.

Coin Publications on Facebook

   Rotographic    

The current range of books. Click the image above to see them on Amazon (printed and Kindle format). More info on coinpublications.com

predecimal.comPredecimal.com. One of the most popular websites on British pre-decimal coins, with hundreds of coins for sale, advice for beginners and interesting information.

Sign in to follow this  
custard1966

1862 Penny G over C

Recommended Posts

Someone else reported a problem uploading images. I'll look into that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm struggling reconciling the shape with that of a C if it's the same C punch used in VICTORIA. It looks more like a slightly clockwise rotated G to me or am I missing something?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The end of top 'arm' of the underlying letter is clearly different to that of the G, so it can't be a G.

The G has a bigger and more concave serif

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The end of top 'arm' of the underlying letter is clearly different to that of the G, so it can't be a G.

The G has a bigger and more concave serif

I can see that, but where there should be a vertical line to the end of the bottom of a C approximately in line with the end of the top serif there isn't and this bit looks more like a rotated G because it has a horizontal top. If it were a reworked die (which given the die flaw, missing or weak serifs to a few letters and less than perfect border teeth in a couple places suggests an old die), there is no reason to assume that the letter punch must have the same precise shape which it would be if done as part of the same punching . It is well documented that you have different shaped Ds on the widow head halfcrowns for example.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I had not seen this thread before and as the picture is not available wondered if it was the vi..G..toria penny everyone seems to be looking for.

The thread is eleven years old and the original poster has not been on here for for a long time.

Maybe you remember Rob ?.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I vaguely recall it was rotated and not the VIGTORIA. It's a long time ago. Last time I met the person posting was at LCA sale no. 4 or 5? ish. Or maybe earlier.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest BayGateWay
On 30/03/2017 at 3:25 PM, Rob said:

I vaguely recall it was rotated and not the VIGTORIA. It's a long time ago. Last time I met the person posting was at LCA sale no. 4 or 5? ish. Or maybe earlier.

On 27/04/2006 at 6:22 PM, custard1966 said:

Recently purchased, tried to attach a file but keep getting an error that the type is not allowed (jpg and jpeg)

link here

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...AMEWN%3AIT&rd=1

I think I have one of these VIGTORIA coins from 1862. Pic attached. 

1862 penny_ob-1.jpg

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes, that is one! And in reasonable condition too! A valuable find; is it for sale??

Jerry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good find and hat off :)

Was only talking about these on Saturday to a mate and the english grading company now slabbed three.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The number of these is increasing steadily, this is at least the sixth, and the variety only became generally known in the last couple of years. But it is a nice variety, and quite easily spotted, so will be in demand and fetch good prices even with many possible future discoveries. I studiously check all 1862's I come across, as I suspect do many others, maybe will get lucky one day.

Jerry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎27‎/‎04‎/‎2006 at 7:34 PM, Rob said:

I'm struggling reconciling the shape with that of a C if it's the same C punch used in VICTORIA. It looks more like a slightly clockwise rotated G to me or am I missing something?

Pete, to your knowledge have any 1860  2*+ d  pennies been slabbed , as with more VIGTORIA pennies popping up all the time, I have been surprised not to have seen any more 2*+d's turning up than the existing 5 already known.   Terry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I dont think so Terry (i cant see any ) although its sometimes hard to check as it depends as to what they may describe it as :)

Just the 1860 there are over eighty  varieties.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest 1860

1860 2*+d  and 1862 VIGTORIA are the biggest finds in recent times related to British Bronze. Are there any others that occupy a similar place, if so can someone suggest a good book that lists these new varieties?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The only book is the latest Freeman that has the updates of some recent ones including the two you mention.

The biggest finds are the ones nobody knows about and people perhaps are looking for :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, PWA 1967 said:

The only book is the latest Freeman that has the updates of some recent ones including the two you mention.

The biggest finds are the ones nobody knows about and people perhaps are looking for :D

Thanks Pete .     Terry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Rob

Let's say I wanted to sell my 1862 VIGTORIA coin (pic posted 21 Aug 2017). Any thoughts on it's value? The reverse side is a little blemished I should add. Thank you all. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
27 minutes ago, Guest Rob said:

Let's say I wanted to sell my 1862 VIGTORIA coin (pic posted 21 Aug 2017). Any thoughts on it's value? The reverse side is a little blemished I should add. Thank you all. 

I think we would need a pic of the reverse to make a reasoned judgement. I am sure several of us would be interested.

Jerry

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/21/2017 at 9:56 PM, jelida said:

The number of these is increasing steadily, this is at least the sixth, and the variety only became generally known in the last couple of years. But it is a nice variety, and quite easily spotted, so will be in demand and fetch good prices even with many possible future discoveries. I studiously check all 1862's I come across, as I suspect do many others, maybe will get lucky one day.

Jerry

The beauty of this variety is that it is so easily recognisable to the naked eye. 

I wonder how many are extant, and why it was never spotted before. I'd hazard a guess at <25. 

Like you, I check every 1862 for one of four things, F38, F39A, F41 and VIGTORIA.  

You just never know when one will crop up, as indeed it has for our guest.  

 

 

  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, 1949threepence said:

The beauty of this variety is that it is so easily recognisable to the naked eye. 

I wonder how many are extant, and why it was never spotted before. I'd hazard a guess at <25. 

Like you, I check every 1862 for one of four things, F38, F39A, F41 and VIGTORIA.  

You just never know when one will crop up, as indeed it has for our guest.  

 

 

  

And the 2 over 1, and the obverse 3 pairing.

I agree that at the current rate of 2 or 3 publicised discoveries a year,  the total VIGTORIA could well end up in the teens or low 20’s.  I suspect more are found than shown on this forum.

And I am still getting used to the ‘reactions’, seem to keep choosing the wrong one and having to correct the error. Sorry Mike.

Jerry

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, 1949threepence said:

The beauty of this variety is that it is so easily recognisable to the naked eye. 

I wonder how many are extant, and why it was never spotted before. I'd hazard a guess at <25. 

Like you, I check every 1862 for one of four things, F38, F39A, F41 and VIGTORIA.  

You just never know when one will crop up, as indeed it has for our guest.  

 

 

  

This is why the varieties crop up with people looking on the internet and in boxes of low grade coins who maybe never used to bother.

You only have to see a new listing for 1862 penny on ebay and it has a few viewers within minutes on every one.

Unless you are a penny collector not as many would of looked at rang pennies a couple of years ago ,now more people / dealers look out for things and the reason why three 1877 narrow dates have been found just this year and that is just three that i know of.If a coin is scarce there are a lot more low grade ones to check than BU ,so a dealer may have ten nice ones a year  to look at and never bothered with the low grade ones ,the chances of finding a scarce one in ten is pretty slim 

If there are twenty known today there will never be less and the numbers will continue to go up, for as long as people look.I use twenty as an example as below that they may well have been people looking for years and these are proven to be scarce (RARE).

Even ones like 1903 open penny ,1911 Gouby x, two years ago were considered scarce ,i am not saying the buns are going to be found in those numbers but some will continue to be found every year.......even maybe today.

As Jerry mentions there are more found than put on the forum and just wish it was me that could find them 😊

Edited by PWA 1967
  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, jelida said:

And the 2 over 1, and the obverse 3 pairing.

I agree that at the current rate of 2 or 3 publicised discoveries a year,  the total VIGTORIA could well end up in the teens or low 20’s.  I suspect more are found than shown on this forum.

And I am still getting used to the ‘reactions’, seem to keep choosing the wrong one and having to correct the error. Sorry Mike.

Jerry

Yes, them too ! 

I'm also getting used to the reactions, Jerry. Easy to pick the wrong one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, PWA 1967 said:

This is why the varieties crop up with people looking on the internet and in boxes of low grade coins who maybe never used to bother.

You only have to see a new listing for 1862 penny on ebay and it has a few viewers within minutes on every one.

Unless you are a penny collector not as many would of looked at rang pennies a couple of years ago ,now more people / dealers look out for things and the reason why three 1877 narrow dates have been found just this year and that is just three that i know of.If a coin is scarce there are a lot more low grade ones to check than BU ,so a dealer may have ten nice ones a year  to look at and never bothered with the low grade ones ,the chances of finding a scarce one in ten is pretty slim 

If there are twenty known today there will never be less and the numbers will continue to go up, for as long as people look.I use twenty as an example as below that they may well have been people looking for years and these are proven to be scarce (RARE).

Even ones like 1903 open penny ,1911 Gouby x, two years ago were considered scarce ,i am not saying the buns are going to be found in those numbers but some will continue to be found every year.......even maybe today.

As Jerry mentions there are more found than put on the forum and just wish it was me that could find them 😊

Excellent points, Pete. I certainly had no idea that three new narrow date 1877's had been found this year. I know one is for sale at the September LCA - no idea whether it's on Richard's rare penny website or not. Will have to take a look. 

edit: Yes it is. Just recently loaded by the looks. That brings the total known number to 10 on his website. 

Are there any more, or has Richard netted the lot? 

  

Edited by 1949threepence
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, PWA 1967 said:

If there are twenty known today there will never be less and the numbers will continue to go up, for as long as people look.I use twenty as an example as below that they may well have been people looking for years and these are proven to be scarce (RARE).

Even ones like 1903 open penny ,1911 Gouby x, two years ago were considered scarce ,i am not saying the buns are going to be found in those numbers but some will continue to be found every year.......even maybe today.

Still are, surely?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×