The Verene collection of British proofs

[oldcopper 276]

13 minutes ago, 1949threepence said:

Some very interesting info.

With regard to the 1841, I bet you wouldn't see much change from £1500 now.

 

Hey, don't rub it in!

[VickySilver 775]

That PCGS photo of the Proof 65RB is really sensational. I personally rather like the 1853 proof penny....The "off year" large pennies usually just don't have the aesthetics of this one or the 1839.

[VickySilver 775]

This picture doesn’t even look like a proof but it is.

[VickySilver 775]

Scratches on capitol plastic holder

[1949threepence 3,366]

Are some non proofs sneaking through as proofs? We've already seen that slabbing companies are making errors by accepting the customer's assertion on the coin itself, without checking.

Maybe it's the way the pic has been taken, but that really doesn't look anything like a proof. 

[VickySilver 775]

Yes, in hand it certainly is and the coin is in a Capitol Plastics holder, not a TPG slab.

[secret santa 2,013]

Is it the copper proof (P1502) or bronzed copper proof (P1501) ? I don't think that I have ever seen a copper proof penny with full lustre - I assume that, when newly struck, they were lustrous ?

[oldcopper 276]

18 minutes ago, secret santa said:

Is it the copper proof (P1502) or bronzed copper proof (P1501) ? I don't think that I have ever seen a copper proof penny with full lustre - I assume that, when newly struck, they were lustrous ?

Yes they were - both the 1825/6 and the 1853 copper proof 1d to 1/4d's were all seemingly struck with full lustre, a few remain with pretty good lustre as above. Many have toned beautifully, as copper proofs can do.

However, the only really full lustre copper proofs extant are from Soho. The James Watt collection (Morton and Eden 2002) had some incredible1806 copper proofs and 1805 Irish copper proofs, definitely a class above the Royal Mint ones. Brilliant fiery mirrored orange red. A set of the 1806 copper penny to farthing (along with the sets of the gilt and bronzed analogues) reappeared on the market a few years ago.

[1949threepence 3,366]

7 hours ago, VickySilver said:

Yes, in hand it certainly is and the coin is in a Capitol Plastics holder, not a TPG slab.

Probably need to see it in hand then, because from where I'm standing there is absolutely nothing about its appearance, which suggests that it's a proof. Just a slightly scruffy, a/UNC business strike, with pretty much full lustre.

Unless someone can point me to various features on the pic which mark it out as a proof. Maybe I'm missing something. 

Do you have a photo of the reverse?

Maybe this is the sort of coin which at auction would lend itself to being videoed. Rotation through the angles in natural light might aid identification as a proof and show up the mirror like finish - unless prior provenance already exists.