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Bronze & Copper Collector

F-10 penny Repunched R & I in Victoria?

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Posted (edited)

I'm not sure if this has been reported before.

An 1860 F-10 penny with a repunched R & I in VICTORIA.  Second punch on both is at a slight angle to the first.

Additionally, in the image, it appears that the A in VICTORIA is an inverted V. I believe that to be a false impression of the photography. Quite candidly though, I can't really tell if the crossbar of the A is just crud, very faint, or actually missing.

Pictures to follow.

Your thoughts and opinions please.

 

1860 F-10 R over R, I over I     OBVERSE reduced.jpg

Edited by Bronze & Copper Collector
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I have in my own collection a similar example regarding the A/V. I have described it as follows:

there is a clear and sharp but very thin crossbar to the A, possibly as a result of the A being repaired with an overstruck inverted V punch, leaving the the faintest but sharp remains of the crossbar, similar to the residual 8 of the 1861 F30 6 over 8 (see below under 1861 F30). The cross bar is barely visible in the above photograph but clearly and sharply visible at an angle under a magnifying glass. 

1934385356_1860F10invVzoom.JPG.a3b7d4f0ca525401289816bf8911e734.JPG

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Posted (edited)
29 minutes ago, secret santa said:

I have in my own collection a similar example regarding the A/V. I have described it as follows:

there is a clear and sharp but very thin crossbar to the A, possibly as a result of the A being repaired with an overstruck inverted V punch, leaving the the faintest but sharp remains of the crossbar, similar to the residual 8 of the 1861 F30 6 over 8 (see below under 1861 F30). The cross bar is barely visible in the above photograph but clearly and sharply visible at an angle under a magnifying glass. 

1934385356_1860F10invVzoom.JPG.a3b7d4f0ca525401289816bf8911e734.JPG

Hi Richard,

Is yours also on an F-10? Asking because I don't see the repunched R or I.

 

Edited by Bronze & Copper Collector

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1 hour ago, Bronze & Copper Collector said:

Is yours also on an F-10? Asking because I don't see the repunched R or I.

Yes, it's on my collection website. No sign of repunched R or I.

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The problem is that there is no sure way to differentiate between an inverted V and die fill of the crossbar of the ‘A’.  We often see impaired bars to the letters E, F for example and accept them for what they are, but if the same happens to the bar of the ‘A’  we see it as an overstrike. There is no way of knowing, excepting that perhaps in a very high grade coin a microscope might show an undeniably formed edge where the bar should be. Otherwise it’s wishful thinking. I know, I do it too.

Jerry

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I think the case for an overstrike with a "V" punch is strengthened by Gary's picture where the R and I are clearly overstruck.

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23 minutes ago, jelida said:

The problem is that there is no sure way to differentiate between an inverted V and die fill of the crossbar of the ‘A’.  We often see impaired bars to the letters E, F for example and accept them for what they are, but if the same happens to the bar of the ‘A’  we see it as an overstrike. There is no way of knowing, excepting that perhaps in a very high grade coin a microscope might show an undeniably formed edge where the bar should be. Otherwise it’s wishful thinking. I know, I do it too.

Jerry

Agreed.

The only reason I mentioned the A was because, if I did not, someone else would almost be sure to mention the weak/missing crossbar, perhaps thinking that I had missed it.

My primary enquiry was regarding whether or not the repunched R & I were previously known.

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Posted (edited)

My F10 with a repunched T in Victoria . The Vand I are normal

 

1778121131_1860PennyF10ToverTinVictoria.jpg.b411f1624e2df8695cf6b12300cd0a9a.jpg

Edited by mick1271

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Personally, I think repunched legends and dates of early buns are of purely academic interest. Those particular ones (the R and I) are almost undetectable anyway.

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Just checked my F10, and found that the R of VICTORIA is re-punched the same as Gary's. But the A is perfect. 

Also, part of the R of BRITT also looks a bit odd.   

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On 3/4/2022 at 1:49 PM, secret santa said:

I think the case for an overstrike with a "V" punch is strengthened by Gary's picture where the R and I are clearly overstruck.

I have a repunched V high in the field which might explain some of these bars across the V but down the other end 

CM221117-100605074 (269x400).jpg

CM221117-100105068 (290x400).jpg

Edited by DrLarry

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CM221116-222425017 (199x400).jpgCM221116-222505018 (199x400).jpg  apologies wrong A or V 

Edited by DrLarry

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