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copper123

Proof there is no god

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10 hours ago, Peckris 2 said:

For crying out loud, how many times do I have to say:

The big fraud is that they aren't factoring in the relative crime rates of the two demographics.

The last article is a perfect example. I don't even need to look at the first two, because they will undoubtedly be doing the same thing. 

Now, from the relative prison populations, blacks are 5 times more likely than whites to commit crimes. Thus their interactions with police will be 5 times higher than their demographic ratio would suggest. Police aren't shooting at random members of the public or locking up random members of the public are they. They're shooting mainly at criminals or taking criminals into police custody.

Hence to get an accurate perspective, we should not only be basing the numbers on the demographic, which will increase the black number by a factor of 4.5. 

We should also be basing it on the extent of the criminality for each demographic, which will then lower the black number by a factor of 5.

Got it?

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5 hours ago, oldcopper said:

"Now, from the relative prison populations, blacks are 5 times more likely than whites to commit crimes. 

Correlation is not causation.

Blacks are 5 times more likely to be CONVICTED than whites for the same offense. This is particularly true for drug related charges, even more so in states where there are private "for profit" prisons. Under the three strikes and you're out legislation there are thousands of black men and women serving life for possesion of a drug that is now legal in eleven states.

The following was published by the NAACP

 

CRIMINAL JUSTICE FACT SHEET

 

 

Incarceration Trends in America

Between 1980 and 2015, the number of people incarcerated in America increased from roughly 500,000 to over 2.2 million.

Today, the United States makes up about 5% of the world’s population and has 21% of the world’s prisoners.

1 in every 37 adults in the United States, or 2.7% of the adult population, is under some form of correctional supervision.

CJ_StopFriskRacial Disparities in Incarceration

In 2014, African Americans constituted 2.3 million, or 34%, of the total 6.8 million correctional population.

African Americans are incarcerated at more than 5 times the rate of whites.

The imprisonment rate for African American women is twice that of white women.

Nationwide, African American children represent 32% of children who are arrested,

42% of children who are detained, and 52% of children whose cases are judicially

waived to criminal court.

Though African Americans and Hispanics make up approximately 32% of the US

population, they comprised 56% of all incarcerated people in 2015.

If African Americans and Hispanics were incarcerated at the same rates as whites,

prison and jail populations would decline by almost 40%.

Drug Sentencing Disparities

In the 2015 National Survey on Drug Use and Health, about 17 million whites and 4 million African Americans reported having used an illicit drug within the last month.

African Americans and whites use drugs at similar rates, but the imprisonment rate of African Americans for drug charges is almost 6 times that of whites.

African Americans represent 12.5% of illicit drug users, but 29% of those arrested for drug offenses and 33% of those incarcerated in state facilities for drug offenses.

Effects of Incarceration

A criminal record can reduce the likelihood of a callback or job offer by nearly 50 percent. The negative impact of a criminal record is twice as large for African American applicants.

Infectious diseases are highly concentrated in corrections facilities: 15% of jail inmates and 22% of prisoners – compared to 5% of the general population – reported ever having tuberculosis, Hepatitis B and C, HIV/AIDS, or other STDs.

In 2012 alone, the United States spent nearly $81 billion on corrections.

Spending on prisons and jails has increased at triple the rate of spending on Pre‐K‐12 public education in the last thirty years.

 

 

 

 

 

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I see that Justin Welby, Archbishop of Canterbury, is now questioning whether Jesus, the son of God, should no longer be viewed as White.

From the figures above, one can only conclude that if there was a God, he is both White and vindictive.

And hypocritical, in begetting a son of colour, if Justin were right.

Surely we should be told the truth?

Like many species, humans are territorial and aggressively defend their Tribe and their patch. There is no God.

But Covid 19 is made in his image.

 


 

 

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3 hours ago, bagerap said:

Correlation is not causation.

Blacks are 5 times more likely to be CONVICTED than whites for the same offense. This is particularly true for drug related charges, even more so in states where there are private "for profit" prisons. Under the three strikes and you're out legislation there are thousands of black men and women serving life for possesion of a drug that is now legal in eleven states.

The following was published by the NAACP

 

CRIMINAL JUSTICE FACT SHEET

 

 

Incarceration Trends in America

Between 1980 and 2015, the number of people incarcerated in America increased from roughly 500,000 to over 2.2 million.

Today, the United States makes up about 5% of the world’s population and has 21% of the world’s prisoners.

1 in every 37 adults in the United States, or 2.7% of the adult population, is under some form of correctional supervision.

CJ_StopFriskRacial Disparities in Incarceration

In 2014, African Americans constituted 2.3 million, or 34%, of the total 6.8 million correctional population.

African Americans are incarcerated at more than 5 times the rate of whites.

The imprisonment rate for African American women is twice that of white women.

Nationwide, African American children represent 32% of children who are arrested,

42% of children who are detained, and 52% of children whose cases are judicially

waived to criminal court.

Though African Americans and Hispanics make up approximately 32% of the US

population, they comprised 56% of all incarcerated people in 2015.

If African Americans and Hispanics were incarcerated at the same rates as whites,

prison and jail populations would decline by almost 40%.

Drug Sentencing Disparities

In the 2015 National Survey on Drug Use and Health, about 17 million whites and 4 million African Americans reported having used an illicit drug within the last month.

African Americans and whites use drugs at similar rates, but the imprisonment rate of African Americans for drug charges is almost 6 times that of whites.

African Americans represent 12.5% of illicit drug users, but 29% of those arrested for drug offenses and 33% of those incarcerated in state facilities for drug offenses.

Effects of Incarceration

A criminal record can reduce the likelihood of a callback or job offer by nearly 50 percent. The negative impact of a criminal record is twice as large for African American applicants.

Infectious diseases are highly concentrated in corrections facilities: 15% of jail inmates and 22% of prisoners – compared to 5% of the general population – reported ever having tuberculosis, Hepatitis B and C, HIV/AIDS, or other STDs.

In 2012 alone, the United States spent nearly $81 billion on corrections.

Spending on prisons and jails has increased at triple the rate of spending on Pre‐K‐12 public education in the last thirty years.

 

 

 

 

 

Where's the information about blacks being 5 times more likely to be imprisoned for "the same offence"? What it says is that blacks are almost 6x more likely to be imprisoned for "drug charges". And the same proportions of blacks and whites use drugs. Not the same thing. "Drug offenses" mentioned in the next paragraph is similarly not just "drug use" but presumably more serious drug offenses as well.

The obvious explanation is there is a much higher proportion of drug dealers among blacks. Recreational use of a drug is the lowest level of drug crime; dealing and distribution are higher: the offenders will more likely have a much greater quantity of a drug as well when arrested. And it will also depend on how hard the drugs are - is there a different profile of popular drugs in both communities?  A small amount of recreational cannabis is probably overlooked, but heroin will be treated differently. You might have some more specific figures, if so let us know, but on the above, you can't tell anything as they are not comparing like to like. 

Nasty diseases picked up in prison, we won't go into the reasons. Whites have a higher mortality rate in prisons than blacks or Hispanics apparently - if it was the other way round, there would no doubt be a fuss about it.

That's sad about the criminal record information, but blacks are overwhelmingly over-represented in all violent crime and theft, so I can understand if an employer is going to be wary about that. The trouble is it's a chicken and egg scenario, which will be difficult to break.

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3 hours ago, jelida said:

I see that Justin Welby, Archbishop of Canterbury, is now questioning whether Jesus, the son of God, should no longer be viewed as White.

From the figures above, one can only conclude that if there was a God, he is both White and vindictive.

And hypocritical, in begetting a son of colour, if Justin were right.

Surely we should be told the truth?

Like many species, humans are territorial and aggressively defend their Tribe and their patch. There is no God.

But Covid 19 is made in his image.

 


 

 

Welby is gullible enough to believe in the immaculate conception (by accepting that Jesus is the son of God) so why does his naive credulity not extend to the more plausible notion of Jesus being born white? Surely, to an intelligent mind, a genetic malfunction is more plausible than believing that Mary was impregnated by an intangible entity. 

Of course, Jesus, being a Nazarene, is more likely to have had a dark skin, that is obvious,  but then one would think that Welby would do better not to pander to the lowest common denominator but address the more important question of how did he get here in the first place.

To quote Mr. Hitchens “What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence”

 

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10 hours ago, oldcopper said:

For crying out loud, how many times do I have to say:

The big fraud is that they aren't factoring in the relative crime rates of the two demographics.

The last article is a perfect example. I don't even need to look at the first two, because they will undoubtedly be doing the same thing. 

Now, from the relative prison populations, blacks are 5 times more likely than whites to commit crimes. Thus their interactions with police will be 5 times higher than their demographic ratio would suggest. Police aren't shooting at random members of the public or locking up random members of the public are they. They're shooting mainly at criminals or taking criminals into police custody.

Hence to get an accurate perspective, we should not only be basing the numbers on the demographic, which will increase the black number by a factor of 4.5. 

We should also be basing it on the extent of the criminality for each demographic, which will then lower the black number by a factor of 5.

Got it?

What I've "got" is that the only 'good' statistics or articles are those which bolster your own position. Everything else can be dismissed.

Well, I'm sorry, but your position in relation to blacks is dreadful. I've had enough of it, I don't have the energy to fight or argue as I'm tired all the time now. You can look in the mirror if you need to carry on this 'discussion'.

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You know what Old Copper? I'm giving up and following the advice of Mark Twain. “Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.”

 

Hope the laundry doesn't lose your white sheets in the wash.

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1 hour ago, Peckris 2 said:

What I've "got" is that the only 'good' statistics or articles are those which bolster your own position. Everything else can be dismissed.

Well, I'm sorry, but your position in relation to blacks is dreadful. I've had enough of it, I don't have the energy to fight or argue as I'm tired all the time now. You can look in the mirror if you need to carry on this 'discussion'.

Well, if you can't see the lies you're being fed, that's your lookout. I thought this would happen with you, as I've backed you into a corner of having to discuss my point which lets the police off. So it's flounce off time. That's a shame. All my statistics are official government statistics, and I've drawn the correct conclusions from them. So a bit of thinking and reasoned argument would have been appreciated, but i don't think you had any. 

I remember you tried this faux-outrage when I pointed out BAME voting patterns. Then when I showed it was in a BBC report, you went a bit quiet.

Anyway, this is where your dogma has now got you - you support an organisation that wants to defund the police, and the consequences of that mean losing the entire justice system, the prisons, the lot, because the police are the foundation and enforcement of all that of course. So no rule of law - who should be looking in the mirror, now? 

 

 

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2 hours ago, bagerap said:

You know what Old Copper? I'm giving up and following the advice of Mark Twain. “Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.”

 

Hope the laundry doesn't lose your white sheets in the wash.

So you haven't got any specific data on my previous request, I'm not surprised and I've called your bluff on this -  what you said was rubbish - it clearly didn't say that black people get convicted 6x more often than white people for the same offence , it said 6x more blacks than whites go to prison for "drug offenses". Which is a completely different meaning. You don't realize that?  But, like Peckers, just shoot the messenger - that'll hide the embarrassment. 

Every one of the convoluted points you've made so far can be dismissed in seconds, as  I have done. The sad thing is you're so desperate to prove it's white racism, but you can't make that charge stick. Why are you so desperate to prove that narrative, can't you think for yourself?

Edited by oldcopper

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1 hour ago, oldcopper said:

Well, if you can't see the lies you're being fed, that's your lookout. I thought this would happen with you, as I've backed you into a corner No you haven't except inside your own head of having to discuss my point which lets the police off. So it's flounce off time. Spin it any which fucking way you want, which is your main MO That's a shame. All my statistics are official government statistics, and I've drawn the correct conclusions from them. So a bit of thinking and reasoned argument would have been appreciated, but i don't think you had any. We've given you that, but AS I SAID ABOVE you only read stats and articles which suit your sad points.

I remember you tried this faux-outrage when I pointed out BAME voting patterns. Then when I showed it was in a BBC report, you went a bit quiet.

Anyway, this is where your dogma has now got you - you support an organisation that wants to defund the police, Uh? What the f**k are you burbling about? and the consequences of that mean losing the entire justice system, the prisons, the lot, because the police are the foundation and enforcement of all that of course. So no rule of law - who should be looking in the mirror, now? You should, along with your ex-policemen NRA buddies.

Now you can spin this as a flounce if you like. I'm going to let you have the last and probably very unpleasant word. Be my guest. Goodbye. I'm blocking you now.

 

 

 

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On 6/21/2020 at 8:04 PM, copper123 said:

The strange thing in statistics is the black and asian citizens are more prone to covid19 it's often mooted as a fact.

Are not black and asians more prone to be diabetic as well.

Being diabetic make you more prone to covid19 this fact  is never mentioned in the media , its alway "why are black and asian folks so prone to it"

Just switching tack here to a more bright and hopeful stance - there are reports that the virus is weakening, maybe via mutation, and causing fewer deaths than it did, among the same cohorts. 

So maybe if there is a second spike, it won't be anything like as deadly as the first - Fingers crossed. 

By the way just a quick shout out here for the many hospital staff, some of whom have sadly passed away from Covid 19 in the last few months - they courageously put themselves in harm's way 24/7 to look after sufferers. Some have sadly paid the ultimate price for that dedication. Again, disproportionately, BAME medical staff. All these guys, from whatever background, have my maximum respect for undertaking a job I couldn't even imagine doing at the best of times.   

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8 hours ago, 1949threepence said:

Just switching tack here to a more bright and hopeful stance - there are reports that the virus is weakening, maybe via mutation, and causing fewer deaths than it did, among the same cohorts. 

So maybe if there is a second spike, it won't be anything like as deadly as the first - Fingers crossed. 

By the way just a quick shout out here for the many hospital staff, some of whom have sadly passed away from Covid 19 in the last few months - they courageously put themselves in harm's way 24/7 to look after sufferers. Some have sadly paid the ultimate price for that dedication. Again, disproportionately, BAME medical staff. All these guys, from whatever background, have my maximum respect for undertaking a job I couldn't even imagine doing at the best of times.   

Yes I think what happened in 1918-19  with the millions dead after that is wavering over what government are doing at the moment.

Things do look very hopefull here but south america , jesus what a mess , doing it all wrong.

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2 hours ago, copper123 said:

Things do look very hopefull here but south america , jesus what a mess , doing it all wrong.

I can’t get over the situation in the USA, a wealthy, advanced country that should have been able to lead the world in managing this crisis, but because of a few idiots in government they have thrown it all away in the cause of the self-aggrandisement of the chief idiot, and at the expense of tens, potentially hundreds of thousands of additional deaths. I do hope the nation sees sense in November.

Jerry

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7 hours ago, jelida said:

I can’t get over the situation in the USA, a wealthy, advanced country that should have been able to lead the world in managing this crisis, but because of a few idiots in government they have thrown it all away in the cause of the self-aggrandisement of the chief idiot, and at the expense of tens, potentially hundreds of thousands of additional deaths. I do hope the nation sees sense in November.

Jerry

The states is a stange place not centrally run yet centrally run , at least it means UKW cannot fcuk up the whole country

Edited by copper123

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10 hours ago, jelida said:

I can’t get over the situation in the USA, a wealthy, advanced country that should have been able to lead the world in managing this crisis, but because of a few idiots in government they have thrown it all away in the cause of the self-aggrandisement of the chief idiot, and at the expense of tens, potentially hundreds of thousands of additional deaths. I do hope the nation sees sense in November.

Jerry

I couldn't believe what I saw on the news today - an outraged idiot in the States saying "how dare the government threaten our constitutional rights by telling us whether or not we can go out, whether we have to wear masks. I love the flag and I'm ready to die for it." I have no doubt that more of these idiots WILL die, coughing their guts up and gasping for oxygen while celebrating their 'freedoms'. That kind of mindset is virtually unknown here in Britain. Happily it's not the majority in America either.

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24 minutes ago, Peckris 2 said:

That kind of mindset is virtually unknown here in Britain.

Have you not seen the morons on the beach and at illegal raves..............................?

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4 minutes ago, secret santa said:

Have you not seen the morons on the beach and at illegal raves..............................?

Very true. But it's a very different kind of mindset, more comprehensible (to me) though moronic, as you say.

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8 hours ago, Peckris 2 said:

I couldn't believe what I saw on the news today - an outraged idiot in the States saying "how dare the government threaten our constitutional rights by telling us whether or not we can go out, whether we have to wear masks. I love the flag and I'm ready to die for it." I have no doubt that more of these idiots WILL die, coughing their guts up and gasping for oxygen while celebrating their 'freedoms'. That kind of mindset is virtually unknown here in Britain. Happily it's not the majority in America either.

Yes, they do seem to have a much more reckless mindset than we here in the UK do, despite the crowded beaches here. I note that in some states (notably Texas) there has been another massive spike since lockdown was lifted. Other states like Montana, have barely been affected at all, even from the start - perhaps reflecting smaller towns and a more rural lifestyle. Montana borders Canada (population 37.6 million, and 8000 covid deaths, so in absolute terms and proportionately, much less than ours).

Interestingly, the latest US spike is affecting a much younger cohort than previously - predominantly 30's this time.

Here in the UK we do have our problems with morons who flock to the beach in large numbers, and the illegal raves, but at least that's outdoors, and hopefully the strong UV light will be mitigating the virus, on the beach anyway. Also, as far as I can tell, we don't (so far) seem to have been adversely affected by the previous waves of beach goers from several weeks ago, nor by the demonstrators. I did notice many of those demonstrators wore face masks, as did those who stood in front of statues to protect them.    

I wonder how the spike in Leicester will be dealt with.  

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