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1949threepence

Had a field day on e bay......

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As I've now virtually completed the Edward VII and George V series of pennies (with one or two notable exceptions) I decided I would buy the entire series of George VI currency issue pennies, in one go if possible, and so scanned e bay for worthy candidates. Bought the lot bar one, apart from distinguishing between the three 1937, and two 1940 Freeman types. Can do that later.

Of course, with George VI, the prices are much, much lower than with previous reigns, and there's a plethora to choose from. This means you can pretty much take your pick. So I decided my criteria would not necessarily be to relentlessly pursue BU full lustre in every case, but instead concentrate on eye appeal and most importantly, obtaining issue free specimens. I managed this successfully, including 1950 and 1951, with one exception, the 1944. To be sure, there were a large number of 1944's available, but the quality was slightly disappointing.

Another day for that one, and the different Freeman types, but overall very pleased. Just got to wait for them to arrive now. Hope there's no hitches in that direction.      

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4 minutes ago, PWA 1967 said:

All good fun Mike :D

I have a spare UNC 1944 if you want one ,just PM me.

Great. Thanks Pete, could you send me a pic?

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Well done.

I found the 1944 in good nick way more elusive that one would think....

Wonder why?

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Yes agreed it definately is one of the hardest dates in UNC.

Maybe as none had been minted for four years more were circulated ,although thats just a guess 🙂

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1 hour ago, blakeyboy said:

Well done.

I found the 1944 in good nick way more elusive that one would think....

Wonder why?

Thanks !

1 hour ago, PWA 1967 said:

Yes agreed it definately is one of the hardest dates in UNC.

Maybe as none had been minted for four years more were circulated ,although thats just a guess 🙂

It's quite strange why it should be so elusive in good nick, considering the high mintage.

Possibly Pete, although the same isn't true of 1961, where arguably there was a 12 year gap.

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16 minutes ago, 1949threepence said:

Thanks !

It's quite strange why it should be so elusive in good nick, considering the high mintage.

Possibly Pete, although the same isn't true of 1961, where arguably there was a 12 year gap.

At first i thought .....well thats blown that theory :D

Although again the 1961 is more elusive than the others in the sixties , yes there are millions of them but hopefully you understand what i mean .

People pay 20p more for a 1961 :D

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1961-1d-Elizabeth-II-bronze-Penny-UNC-and-lustrous/153447110932?hash=item23ba291914:g:CKIAAOSwykpchj2U

As Declan mentions in his description.

Edited by PWA 1967

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17 minutes ago, PWA 1967 said:

At first i thought .....well thats blown that theory :D

Although again the 1961 is more elusive than the others in the sixties , yes there are millions of them but hopefully you understand what i mean .

People pay 20p more for a 1961 :D

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1961-1d-Elizabeth-II-bronze-Penny-UNC-and-lustrous/153447110932?hash=item23ba291914:g:CKIAAOSwykpchj2U

As Declan mentions in his description.

Crikey Pete, I never realised :wacko:

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45 minutes ago, 1949threepence said:

Crikey Pete, I never realised :wacko:

 

If someone had asked me some of the scarcest dates IMO in true UNC POST 1900 that can be found easily  are 1926 ,1934 & 1944 so does follow a pattern.

Or is it just a coincidence 🙂

Edited by PWA 1967

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The 1937 are probably the least exciting (to me) penny varieties - none of them is rare and they are micro varieties at best. The two 1940s are a different matter; the 'common' one is fairly elusive in BU but the other one (rated N in Freeman) is a bugger to get. I was lucky enough to get mine from John Dunkerton of Windsor Coins in the late 70s when collectors weren't too bothered about them.

The 1944 is - as you've found - surprisingly hard in genuine Unc; mine is AUnc only but I've never been either enthused to upgrade or seen one at the right price.

I cannot find a high grade 1946 O N E ' for love nor money. Should you find two in your search, let me know!!

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11 minutes ago, Peckris 2 said:

The 1937 are probably the least exciting (to me) penny varieties - none of them is rare and they are micro varieties at best. The two 1940s are a different matter; the 'common' one is fairly elusive in BU but the other one (rated N in Freeman) is a bugger to get. I was lucky enough to get mine from John Dunkerton of Windsor Coins in the late 70s when collectors weren't too bothered about them.

The 1944 is - as you've found - surprisingly hard in genuine Unc; mine is AUnc only but I've never been either enthused to upgrade or seen one at the right price.

I cannot find a high grade 1946 O N E ' for love nor money. Should you find two in your search, let me know!!

At least it's very easy to spot, Chris. I'm looking for a 1940 with a single exergual line.

If I spot a couple of decent 1946 O N E ', types I'll let you know !

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44 minutes ago, Peckris 2 said:

The 1937 are probably the least exciting (to me) penny varieties - none of them is rare and they are micro varieties at best. The two 1940s are a different matter; the 'common' one is fairly elusive in BU but the other one (rated N in Freeman) is a bugger to get. I was lucky enough to get mine from John Dunkerton of Windsor Coins in the late 70s when collectors weren't too bothered about them.

The 1944 is - as you've found - surprisingly hard in genuine Unc; mine is AUnc only but I've never been either enthused to upgrade or seen one at the right price.

I cannot find a high grade 1946 O N E ' for love nor money. Should you find two in your search, let me know!!

It is hard to find a decent one, this is the best one iv managed to find so far i picked it up about a year ago, not as nice as  RIchards  though.

70241835_1946dotterrylow2.JPG.2640d44b83c7b64797ec048633a158eb.JPG

 

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Thats a good one Terry and hat off and Richards is the best i have seen.

One sold graded as GEF for £340 + at LCA nearly two years ago.

They will be RARE in UNC as Dave Craddock has only had one in nearly fifty yearrs.

Plenty in low grade though 🙂

Edited by PWA 1967

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18 hours ago, Peckris 2 said:

The 1937 are probably the least exciting (to me) penny varieties - none of them is rare and they are micro varieties at best. The two 1940s are a different matter; the 'common' one is fairly elusive in BU but the other one (rated N in Freeman) is a bugger to get. I was lucky enough to get mine from John Dunkerton of Windsor Coins in the late 70s when collectors weren't too bothered about them.

The 1944 is - as you've found - surprisingly hard in genuine Unc; mine is AUnc only but I've never been either enthused to upgrade or seen one at the right price.

I cannot find a high grade 1946 O N E ' for love nor money. Should you find two in your search, let me know!!

The one I initially bought turned out, on inspection, to be an F217. Just had a further scan of e bay and easily managed to buy good quality versions of F219 and 221 - within 5 minutes.   

Whereas earlier I waded through......well, lost count........of 1940 pennies on advanced search, and after finding they were all double exergue, eventually lost the will to live with any more searching.   

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16 hours ago, PWA 1967 said:

Thats a good one Terry and hat off and Richards is the best i have seen.

One sold graded as GEF for £340 + at LCA nearly two years ago.

They will be RARE in UNC as Dave Craddock has only had one in nearly fifty yearrs.

Plenty in low grade though 🙂

That's seriously scarce.

By the way, thanks for the neat 1944, Pete. Arrived today. 

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18 hours ago, terrysoldpennies said:

It is hard to find a decent one, this is the best one iv managed to find so far i picked it up about a year ago, not as nice as  RIchards  though.

70241835_1946dotterrylow2.JPG.2640d44b83c7b64797ec048633a158eb.JPG

 

EF with plenty of Mint toning - I'd be happy enough with that. :) 

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17 hours ago, PWA 1967 said:

Thats a good one Terry and hat off and Richards is the best i have seen.

One sold graded as GEF for £340 + at LCA nearly two years ago.

They will be RARE in UNC as Dave Craddock has only had one in nearly fifty yearrs.

Plenty in low grade though 🙂

Plenty-ISH. Michael Gouby rates them as one level of scarcity rarer than the 1926ME.

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I have two of the 1946's. One has a "'hyphen" like the one shown above, and one has a perfectly round "dot".

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12 hours ago, Peckris 2 said:

Plenty-ISH. Michael Gouby rates them as one level of scarcity rarer than the 1926ME.

Yes its always going to be less  than a normal coin of the same year due to it just being a FLAW / DOT.

The 1897 DOT and 1909 DOT are the same and more than enough for anyone who wants one and they are turning up all the time.

However as there are less of them than just the normal date to find them better than VF is going to be much harder.

So plenty or plenty -ish ....You can find them all in low grade quite easily.

Probably most people dont even look as either have them or dont want them :D

 

 

 

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Interesting that unlike the 147, Freeman doesn't ascribe them a separate number but instead a footnote, which reads: "Some specimens have a small elongated raised dot in the field above the E of ONE caused probably by damage to the die".

Hence the fact that as in Bob's two, there will be differences in the appearance, as the die damage built up. 

Edited by 1949threepence

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2 minutes ago, 1949threepence said:

Interesting that unlike the 148, Freeman doesn't ascribe them a separate number but instead a footnote, which reads: "Some specimens have a small elongated raised dot in the field above the E of ONE caused probably by damage to the die".

Hence the fact that as in Bob's two, there will be differences in the appearance, as the die damage built up. 

Yes Mike.....your SPOT on :D

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1 hour ago, PWA 1967 said:

Yes its always going to be less  than a normal coin of the same year due to it just being a FLAW / DOT.

The 1897 DOT and 1909 DOT are the same and more than enough for anyone who wants one and they are turning up all the time.

However as there are less of them than just the normal date to find them better than VF is going to be much harder.

So plenty or plenty -ish ....You can find them all in low grade quite easily.

Probably most people dont even look as either have them or dont want them :D

 

 

 

It's the extreme scarcity in high grade which marks them out as very collectable, Pete. In my opinion at least. 

As you said, Dave Craddock has seen only one UNC 1946 ONE ' in nearly 50 years. That tells you they're as rare as hen's teeth in that condition. Probably rarer. 

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Yes Mike i agree and as i mentioned all three are scarce / Rare in high grade.and Peck is not on his own trying to find a high grade 1946.

Think you have more chance of being hit by lightning than finding two 🙂

 

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Only ever seen one- in a group of hi grade 20th century pennies, years ago, on ebay.

I left a high bid, but was way off....

I'd leave a bid massively higher today.

20:20 hindsight......

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On 4/12/2019 at 10:42 PM, Peckris 2 said:

The 1937 are probably the least exciting (to me) penny varieties - none of them is rare and they are micro varieties at best. The two 1940s are a different matter; the 'common' one is fairly elusive in BU but the other one (rated N in Freeman) is a bugger to get. I was lucky enough to get mine from John Dunkerton of Windsor Coins in the late 70s when collectors weren't too bothered about them.

The 1944 is - as you've found - surprisingly hard in genuine Unc; mine is AUnc only but I've never been either enthused to upgrade or seen one at the right price.

I cannot find a high grade 1946 O N E ' for love nor money. Should you find two in your search, let me know!!

You're right, it is a bugger to get. I searched all UK 1940's the other day, and then searched e bay Canada, Australia and USA - still no luck.

Finally spotted one this morning - got to be probably the 200th (at least) I've looked at. That gives some indication of just how scarce they are. It's only about GF, but at least I've got one. Was cheap as well. Will do until (and IF) a better one comes along. Was going boggle eyed looking :blink:

1940 single exergue line   

 

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