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Descartes

Henry VII - advice please

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Please could I pick an experts brains on my little Henry VII penny. I know it's of the type: one pillar of throne visible, but I'm having difficulties narrowing it down further. Which of the following options is this coin:

 

Type IIa One Pillar above the Leg of the Throne on the King's Right Side; Legend as before—mint-mark heraldic cinquefoil—trefoil stops—lettering A. The reverse cross ending is no. 2 and the sceptre and pillar are lis-topped
Type IIb One Pillar above the Leg of the Throne on the King's Right Side; No mint-mark—trefoil stops—lettering A. The reverse cross ending is sometimes no. 2 and sometimes no. 7. The sceptre and pillar are trefoil-topped. Were it not for the existence of the two sorts of reverse found linked with this obverse, one would have placed it as earlier than the heraldic cinquefoil.
Type IIc One Pillar above the Leg of the Throne on the King's Right Side; Mint-mark lis—rosette stops—lettering B—reverse cross ending is no. 7. The sceptre and pillar are trefoil-topped.

HVII.jpg

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None of the above. You have a lis topped sceptre and a trefoil topped pillar. But given the absence of initial mark, you would have to say IIb. I would guess an early one given the use of the lis on the sceptre. Can't be IIc because the stops are trefoils.

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1 hour ago, Rob said:

None of the above. You have a lis topped sceptre and a trefoil topped pillar. But given the absence of initial mark, you would have to say IIb. I would guess an early one given the use of the lis on the sceptre. Can't be IIc because the stops are trefoils.

Thanks Rob :)  I guess I will need to find a better and more usable classification for the pennies of Henry VII. I'm currently using an old classification I found in an edition of BNJ.

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It isn't important as a broad classification will suffice for most things. Every die is different, so the fact that a particular individual has done something in a personal style is neither here nor there as long as it conforms to a particular class using most features. You can always sub-divide a class based on the odd quirk seen on a particular die, but most of these are inconsequential. Some things clearly take a higher priority such as the initial mark, which we know is changed for a reason. But garnishing or embellishment is not easy to tie down as a deliberate and defining change of detail, and thus worthy of being designated a different type.

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