Brexit and money talk

[ozjohn 552]

The lower GBP has made coins sourced from the UK cheaper at present however the attendant inflation that will come from the drop in the GBP's value will probably increase coin values over time. Maybe some inflation not such a bad thing given the risk of deflation at this time.

As to Brexit I applaud the UK for making such a decision as the FU has morphed from a free trade agreement into a monster that has one aim to destroy economies by foisting a unrealistic currency on its members, uncontrolled migration as well as usurping the laws  of its member states. Much has been made of the UK being locked out of trade with the EU because of tariffs. The truth is the change in the GBP's value will more than compensate for that eventuality.

As for Scotland if they want to go I think they have more to lose by taking this action. They also risk having a controlled border with the rest of the UK if they join the EU given they will have to become part of the Schengen as part of the conditions of joining the EU as immigration was a major issue during the Brexit debate.  I cannot see the UK leaving the back door open  after voting to close off uncontrolled immigration .Of course they will have to join the Euro and tolerate the EU interfering with their legal system in addition to the question of the viability of Scotland surviving as an independent state which sunk the earlier referendum still remains

[Rob 2,998]

3 minutes ago, ozjohn said:

The lower GBP has made coins sourced from the UK cheaper at present however the attendant inflation that will come from the drop in the GBP's value will probably increase coin values over time. Maybe some inflation not such a bad thing given the risk of deflation at this time.

As to Brexit I applaud the UK for making such a decision as the FU has morphed from a free trade agreement into a monster that has one aim to destroy economies by foisting a unrealistic currency on its members, uncontrolled migration as well as usurping the laws  of its member states. Much has been made of the UK being locked out of trade with the EU because of tariffs. The truth is the change in the GBP's value will more than compensate for that eventuality.

As for Scotland if they want to go I think they have more to lose by taking this action. They also risk having a controlled border with the rest of the UK if they join the EU given they will have to become part of the Schengen as part of the conditions of joining the EU as immigration was a major issue during the Brexit debate.  I cannot see the UK leaving the back door open  after voting to close off uncontrolled immigration .Of course they will have to join the Euro and tolerate the EU interfering with their legal system in addition to the question of the viability of Scotland surviving as an independent state which sunk the earlier referendum still remains

The whole saga is rising to a crescendo of scaremongering again, or so it seems. There is much talk of the potential cost of leaving arising from our liabilities - maybe 20bn, or even 40. The point they don't make is that if these are liabilities, then it is money we will have to spend whether in or out. i.e we are b******d either way. It isn't money we would pay in and get back again, it is committed spending which we would lose in any case. Turkey might vote for Christmas, but turkies don't.

Same as with the MPs in the commons complaining that they demand a vote on Brexit - we had one on June 23rd. If they missed it because they were too complacent or arrogant to take it seriously, that is not my fault. Unlike the politicians, the average man in the street took the debate very seriously, ignored the diarrhoeic diatribe emanating from the political parties and made his mind up 4 months ago.

[scott 129]

no we had a yes or no vote.

what people want who voted No is what the vote is for...

the sad thing is.. during the vote when remain took the lead.. the Pound shot up...

and most didn't ignore the spouted crap, otherwise remain would have won.

[ozjohn 552]

I noticed called the EU  FU sorry for the mistake.

[Rob 2,998]

2 hours ago, ozjohn said:

I noticed called the EU  FU sorry for the mistake.

And there was me wishing I had thought of that one.

[azda 973]

8 hours ago, ozjohn said:

The lower GBP has made coins sourced from the UK cheaper at present however the attendant inflation that will come from the drop in the GBP's value will probably increase coin values over time. Maybe some inflation not such a bad thing given the risk of deflation at this time.

As to Brexit I applaud the UK for making such a decision as the FU has morphed from a free trade agreement into a monster that has one aim to destroy economies by foisting a unrealistic currency on its members, uncontrolled migration as well as usurping the laws  of its member states. Much has been made of the UK being locked out of trade with the EU because of tariffs. The truth is the change in the GBP's value will more than compensate for that eventuality.

As for Scotland if they want to go I think they have more to lose by taking this action. They also risk having a controlled border with the rest of the UK if they join the EU given they will have to become part of the Schengen as part of the conditions of joining the EU as immigration was a major issue during the Brexit debate.  I cannot see the UK leaving the back door open  after voting to close off uncontrolled immigration .Of course they will have to join the Euro and tolerate the EU interfering with their legal system in addition to the question of the viability of Scotland surviving as an independent state which sunk the earlier referendum still remains

Ozjohn, your first and second paragraph i agree with you. Now i'll head into the 3rd. As a possible part of the EU and still part of the UK and EU at the minute there is no controlled borders within the EU. True of course it would probably be controlled for other parts of the UK, but this isn't a certainty as no one knows what will happen in the future, but just now as we remain as part of the UK and so still part of the EU we have uncontrolled borders regarding immigrants, the immigration issue isn't really an issue for the Scots as we are welcoming them with open arms.

As for the EU interfering in the legal system, well they do that now as we are part of the UK and therefor part of the EU, whether Scotland would have to use the euro would be open for debate as the UK didn't use it and as part of the UK Scotland didn't either, so the only surviving point in your 3rd paragraph is if Scotland would survive as an independent state, who knows......

Edited October 15, 2016 by azda

[1949threepence 3,366]

3 hours ago, ozjohn said:

I noticed called the EU  FU sorry for the mistake.

Actually, FU might be closer to the truth as far as their thoughts on the UK are concerned   

[1949threepence 3,366]

1 hour ago, azda said:

Ozjohn, your first and second paragraph i agree with you. Now i'll head into the 3rd. As a possible part of the EU and still part of the UK and EU at the minute there is no controlled borders within the EU. True of course it would probably be controlled for other parts of the UK, but this isn't a certainty as no one knows what will happen in the future, but just now as we remain as part of the UK and so still part of the EU we have uncontrolled borders regarding immigrants, the immigration issue isn't really an issue for the Scots as we are welcoming them with open arms.

As for the EU interfering in the legal system, well they do that now as we are part of the UK and therefor part of the EU, whether Scotland would have to use the euro would be open for debate as the UK didn't use it and as part of the UK Scotland didn't either, so the only surviving point in your 3rd paragraph is if Scotland would survive as an independent state, who knows......

Which would be fine with an independent Scotland, as it would be Scotland's choice. The problem would then be the open border, along which migrants would be free to just walk or drive across unimpeded, possibly with attendant ISIS sleeper cells embedded in them. I'd rather we didn't see a Hungarian style barbed wire topped fence, stretching from the Irish Sea to the North Sea, not to mention constant shipping patrols either side, but it may have to come to that.   

Come to think about it, we've also got the open border between Northern Ireland and the Irish Republic to consider about as well. 

 

Edited October 15, 2016 by 1949threepence

[Rob 2,998]

We've got an open border between Lancashire and Yorkshire.

[scott 129]

and Wales and England.

 

[ozjohn 552]

Ireland is not part of the Schengen zone as they refused to join it because they did not want to lose their long standing right to enter the UK without border controls.

Azda. An independent Scotland will have to accept what ever conditions the EU require of them to become a member of the EU. Scotland has not the clout to make any demands.. They would be at the mercy of the what ever the EU demands.To be quite honest with you I think England would be quite happy to see the back of Scotland and the possibility of a controlled border IMO would be a logical consequence if Scotland joined the EU  and was forced to become part of the Schengen zone which is very likely given Scotland's extremely weak position as an independent nation.

Edited October 15, 2016 by ozjohn
Missing word

[azda 973]

15 minutes ago, ozjohn said:

Ireland is not part of the Schengen zone as they refused to join it because they did not want to lose their long standing right to enter the UK without border controls.

Azda. An independent Scotland will have to accept what ever conditions the EU require of them to become a member of the EU. Scotland has not the clout to make any demands.. They would be at the mercy of the what ever the EU demands.To be quite honest with you I think England would be quite happy to see the back of Scotland and the possibility of a controlled border IMO would be a logical consequence if Scotland joined the EU  and was forced to become part of the Schengen zone which is very likely given Scotland's extremely weak position as an independent nation.

Scotland isn't an independent nation, so it's all hear say John

[azda 973]

3 hours ago, 1949threepence said:

Which would be fine with an independent Scotland, as it would be Scotland's choice. The problem would then be the open border, along which migrants would be free to just walk or drive across unimpeded, possibly with attendant ISIS sleeper cells embedded in them. I'd rather we didn't see a Hungarian style barbed wire topped fence, stretching from the Irish Sea to the North Sea, not to mention constant shipping patrols either side, but it may have to come to that.   

Come to think about it, we've also got the open border between Northern Ireland and the Irish Republic to consider about as well. 

 

Erm, if you haven't yet realised Michael, the majority of the idiots are being recruited off the internet, and they are English nationals, how do we patrol those borders?

[1949threepence 3,366]

34 minutes ago, azda said:

Erm, if you haven't yet realised Michael, the majority of the idiots are being recruited off the internet, and they are English nationals, how do we patrol those borders?

We don't add to the problem by importing even more into our midst. Especially completely anonymous ones who can disappear into who knows what woodwork as soon as they arrive.

But the terrorist situation apart, one of the prime reasons for voting out, was the issue of right of free movement for all EU citizens, which would mean that as soon as all those million new migrants in Germany get EU status, as many no doubt will in due course, any number of them are free to come here. As we already have a health service buckling at the seams and a housing/accommodation crisis of massive proportions, we really can't afford to take in too many more.     

 

Edited October 15, 2016 by 1949threepence

[azda 973]

19 minutes ago, 1949threepence said:

We don't add to the problem by importing even more into our midst. Especially completely anonymous ones who can disappear into who knows what woodwork as soon as they arrive.

But the terrorist situation apart, one of the prime reasons for voting out, was the issue of right of free movement for all EU citizens, which would mean that as soon as all those million new migrants in Germany get EU status, as many no doubt will in due course, any number of them are free to come here. As we already have a health service buckling at the seams and a housing/accommodation crisis of massive proportions, we really can't afford to take in too many more.     

 

So do you know your terrorist from your common man? The man on the bus/train/plane could also be one, so how do you judge that? My next point is the most crucial one, if you go to war on a country who has done nothing to your nation what do you expect to happen in the long run? America and Britain both seeked out to invade Iraq on BS grounds of WMDs, nothing found, yet so many innocent civilians are being slaughtered and displaced by the UK and American guns and military hardware, if you don't want the immigrants then leave the bloody country alone, the UK and America started this whole people movement yet when those people want protection from OUR OWN WEAPONS you tell them to piss off. Absolute f*****g joke......Sorry, but there are no grounds that the UK should not take these people that their weapons are slaughtering, nor America, they should also be taking a bulk of them.

Just to add to the point, you said the NHS is buckling, yet there's enough cash for a war, strange one that.....Use the war money to help the NHS, that should add 25,000 nurses and 50 new hospitals......

Edited October 15, 2016 by azda

[1949threepence 3,366]

1 hour ago, azda said:

So do you know your terrorist from your common man? The man on the bus/train/plane could also be one, so how do you judge that? My next point is the most crucial one, if you go to war on a country who has done nothing to your nation what do you expect to happen in the long run? America and Britain both seeked out to invade Iraq on BS grounds of WMDs, nothing found, yet so many innocent civilians are being slaughtered and displaced by the UK and American guns and military hardware, if you don't want the immigrants then leave the bloody country alone, the UK and America started this whole people movement yet when those people want protection from OUR OWN WEAPONS you tell them to piss off. Absolute f*****g joke......Sorry, but there are no grounds that the UK should not take these people that their weapons are slaughtering, nor America, they should also be taking a bulk of them.

Just to add to the point, you said the NHS is buckling, yet there's enough cash for a war, strange one that.....Use the war money to help the NHS, that should add 25,000 nurses and 50 new hospitals......

No, that's precisely the point, we don't know who is and who is not a terrorist among the migrants.

As far as the rest of your post, what has happened politically/militarily, is not down to me or any other ordinary bod who voted out. Indeed, I was fully behind the million or so who demonstrated in March 2003 against the Iraqi invasion. All we are concerned about now is our continued safety.

I'm sure that the USA, and indeed Russia who are now bombing Aleppo and related cities in Syria, could take their fair share of migrants. They are, after all, much bigger than we are.

The NHS is buckling - who's fault that is or whether it can be improved, I don't know. But the fact remains that right now it is buckling and we have to live with that.  

 

[azda 973]

1 hour ago, 1949threepence said:

No, that's precisely the point, we don't know who is and who is not a terrorist among the migrants.

As far as the rest of your post, what has happened politically/militarily, is not down to me or any other ordinary bod who voted out. Indeed, I was fully behind the million or so who demonstrated in March 2003 against the Iraqi invasion. All we are concerned about now is our continued safety.

I'm sure that the USA, and indeed Russia who are now bombing Aleppo and related cities in Syria, could take their fair share of migrants. They are, after all, much bigger than we are.

The NHS is buckling - who's fault that is or whether it can be improved, I don't know. But the fact remains that right now it is buckling and we have to live with that.  

 

You're missing the point completely Michael, the majority are being recruited through the internet already live in the UK and are English born, so blaming migrants is ridiculous, you are blaming them for a problem that already existed

[1949threepence 3,366]

2 hours ago, azda said:

You're missing the point completely Michael, the majority are being recruited through the internet already live in the UK and are English born, so blaming migrants is ridiculous, you are blaming them for a problem that already existed

I don't think so, David. I'm well aware that ISIS does recruit in this country via internet radicalisation. We've obviously already seen many go to Syria to serve alongside IS. But that does not negate the fact that there are terrorists embedded within migrants arriving in Europe - link. That's not blaming migrants per se. I've no doubt the vast majority are decent people who want to start a new life. But it is pointing out a risk of importing terrorism. Even Merkel has admitted that terrorists are among the migrants entering Europe - further link

All the above is quite apart from the other non terrorist related factors I mentioned earlier.

This one of the reasons why the majority in England voted out, and why we wouldn't want an open back door via Scotland if they voted for independence in a Sturgeon inspired second referendum, and stayed in the EU. But they'll have to be quick. Article 50 will be invoked early next year, and we'll be out by 2019.  

       

[ozjohn 552]

7 hours ago, azda said:

Scotland isn't an independent nation, so it's all hear say John

A lower pound makes any threat from the EU on tariffs look pretty silly as U.K. goods will be still competing perhaps more so. Remember the fall of the GBP after the ERM  which lead to a decade of economic growth. Perhaps you may import some inflation which may not be such a bad thing as deflation is seen as the new evil. From my point of view at present buying coins from the UK in cheaper hence my initial comment. On a general note I personally commend the UK for voting to leave the EU monster as it is a compleatly different organisation that seeks to subvert national governments as its priority rather than a free trade zone which the UK joined originally.

[ozjohn 552]

Aida you are right Scotland is not an independent country and as such would not have the power to become independent. This power of course rests with the Westminster government. If the independence referendum was carried I think the Westminster government would have granted independence to Scotland. I also got the feeling at the time that independence ment independence and the Westminster government were going to drive a very hard bargain.

[azda 973]

3 minutes ago, ozjohn said:

Aida you are right Scotland is not an independent country and as such would not have the power to become independent. This power of course rests with the Westminster government. If the independence referendum was carried I think the Westminster government would have granted independence to Scotland. I also got the feeling at the time that independence ment independence and the Westminster government were going to drive a very hard bargain.

John, the independence vote had nothing to do with Westminster, they only agreed to the vote, not grant Independence, that was down to the people to choose.There was nothing that Westminster could drive a bargaining tool against, everything they were telling the Scots was all lies and fear mongering as we see in any major election, similar to Brexit, the BBC was used and still is as a propaganda machine to the advantage of Government.

[azda 973]

On 10/15/2016 at 8:25 PM, 1949threepence said:

I don't think so, David. I'm well aware that ISIS does recruit in this country via internet radicalisation. We've obviously already seen many go to Syria to serve alongside IS. But that does not negate the fact that there are terrorists embedded within migrants arriving in Europe - link. That's not blaming migrants per se. I've no doubt the vast majority are decent people who want to start a new life. But it is pointing out a risk of importing terrorism. Even Merkel has admitted that terrorists are among the migrants entering Europe - further link

All the above is quite apart from the other non terrorist related factors I mentioned earlier.

This one of the reasons why the majority in England voted out, and why we wouldn't want an open back door via Scotland if they voted for independence in a Sturgeon inspired second referendum, and stayed in the EU. But they'll have to be quick. Article 50 will be invoked early next year, and we'll be out by 2019.  

       

http://www.businessforscotland.co.uk/eu-just-put-westminster-rock-hard-place/

[azda 973]

Another for a read

http://www.thecanary.co/2016/10/18/theresa-may-just-dropped-brexit-bombshell-going-cost-us-billions-tweets/

[1949threepence 3,366]

12 minutes ago, azda said:

Another for a read

http://www.thecanary.co/2016/10/18/theresa-may-just-dropped-brexit-bombshell-going-cost-us-billions-tweets/

I guarantee that May will do almost anything to stay in the single market. Even if in modified form. 

[azda 973]

15 minutes ago, 1949threepence said:

I guarantee that May will do almost anything to stay in the single market. Even if in modified form. 

I doubt she'll get anywhere without the freedom of movement chapter which was why people partly voted for Brexit in the first place