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CGS "membership" Fee

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I have just noticed that if you click on the "sign up" button on the CGS web site, it is now asking an annual membership fee of £99!

http://www.coingradingservices.co.uk/?page=signup

It is not clear what benefit you get from having membership beyond being able to view their population reports etc. and this is hardly worth £99 a year. I have got my free membership some years ago and will definitely not keep it if CGS were to ask me for money.

If they were to insist on having paid membership to slab coins in the future, then I am done with them.

 

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Wow that's not good. For anyone who doesn't already have a log in to view the coins and can't see them, PM me because I don't slab any coins I just use my log in to view them and search for UINs, happy to share my username/password so you don't need to pay for an annual subscription..

For those I know and can trust of course :ph34r:

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And I wanted to see "The Coinery" collections....

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I bet this will make a lot of coin sellers angry, who is going to pay £99 to check a coin!

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I must have just got in in time - only joined recently. I wouldn't pay for it either.

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On 17/04/2016 at 2:25 PM, Nordle11 said:

Wow that's not good. For anyone who doesn't already have a log in to view the coins and can't see them, PM me because I don't slab any coins I just use my log in to view them and search for UINs, happy to share my username/password so you don't need to pay for an annual subscription..

For those I know and can trust of course :ph34r:

I do the same as you Mat. My coins are all loose, bar a couple I got from a friend on here. I use it as a resource, I certainly wouldn't pay £99 for it. It seems self defeating in respect that you want everything to be transparent and crystal clear. If I was to start collecting slabbed coins and wanted to verify them I certainly wouldn't use a company that would charge me a fee to do so. Hopefully it is some kind of misunderstanding or error as surely it will lead to a major loss of business and revenue for them.

 

Edited by bhx7

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1 hour ago, bhx7 said:

I do the same as you Mat. My coins are all loose, bar a couple I got from a friend on here. I use it as a resource, I certainly wouldn't pay £99 for it. It seems self defeating in respect that you want everything to be transparent and crystal clear. If I was to start collecting slabbed coins and wanted to verify them I certainly wouldn't use a company that would charge me a fee to do so. Hopefully it is some kind of misunderstanding or error as surely it will lead to a major loss of business and revenue for them.

 

As I understand it (from Bill Pugsley), it is not an error. But it is a mistake in my view, there seems to have been an increase in coins submitted to CGS over the last 2 years or so, and an increase in demand for using their site to verify coins and as a resource for benchmarks, I use it myself nearly every day. The fee is for new 'members' only at the moment, and is under review. At a time when they are still trying to gain traction and credibility in the TPG arena, this is a high risk strategy which could set them back a good way imo.

Bill has a Facebook Group 'Coin Grading Services (CGS) Collectors' for the latest.

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Thanks for the clarification Paulus. I think he is definately shooting himself in the foot!!!! Off course thats my opinion.

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Geezus, asking £30 a submission and taking up to 3 months to get it back is bad enough, now another £99 for membership for the lovely customer service from Serma is just a joke. I think it could be a nail in the coffin right there. Let's see how many submissions they'll lose if they ask the same fee from people who are already members. There is ABSOLUTEY no benefit of paying a yearly subscription, at least with PCGS you get 4 free submission for your $149 membership and a turnaround of about 3 weeks

Edited by azda
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1 hour ago, azda said:

Geezus, asking £30 a submission and taking up to 3 months to get it back is bad enough, now another £99 for membership for the lovely customer service from Serma is just a joke. I think it could be a nail in the coffin right there. Let's see how many submissions they'll lose if they ask the same fee from people who are already members. There is ABSOLUTEY no benefit of paying a yearly subscription, at least with PCGS you get 4 free submission for your $149 membership and a turnaround of about 3 weeks

As I see it, you can be relieved of £99 for the privilege of CGS membership, or the £s equivalent of £102 for PCGS membership, both of which profess to offer an opinion that I am incapable of making myself. Either way I'm about £100 lighter in the pocket. Vive la difference.

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1 minute ago, Rob said:

As I see it, you can be relieved of £99 for the privilege of CGS membership, or the £s equivalent of £102 for PCGS membership, both of which profess to offer an opinion that I am incapable of making myself. Either way I'm about £100 lighter in the pocket. Vive la difference.

Ahhhh but those 4 free grades Rob still makes it cheaper than CGS, they also don't have Semra as their customer care manager, that has to add to the bonuses of non CGS membership 

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Fully agree. I've never slabbed a coin and I've still had the displeasure of dealing with Semra. Definitely a big con of dealing with either LCA or CGS, let alone paying £99 to deal with her.

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£100 not wasted on membership will probably land me a fairly hard to find medieval episcopal penny. They aren't that expensive, primarily because they rarely turn up in a desirable grade.

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I think Semra now thinks that CGS are now getting on par with the big 2 American companies judging by the fee, i can see a big custard pie running down her face, a small increase in submissions won't justify the £99, what will happen if/when submissions drop after the introduction? (custard pie :-)

Whoever came up with this business strategy needs to take a reality check.....

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2 minutes ago, azda said:

I think Semra now thinks that CGS are now getting on par with the big 2 American companies judging by the fee, i can see a big custard pie running down her face, a small increase in submissions won't justify the £99, what will happen if/when submissions drop after the introduction? (custard pie :-)

Whoever came up with this business strategy needs to take a reality check.....

Yes, I have never understood the rationale for paying someone unknown to give an opinion which is no more valid than my own......... I'll give my opinion for free.

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Looks like CGS have just changed their pricing model. You will now need to send them £499 for lifetime 'elite' membership and as a prepayment for grading coins as below:

"

The Coin Grading and Encapsulation service is only available to members (CGS Elite Member). The cost of becoming a CGS Elite Member is £ 499 however the first £ 499 spent on grading fees is deductible off the membership fee. So if you are expecting to spend at least £ 499 on CGS grading then becoming a CGS Elite Member is for you. The CGS Elite membership runs indefinitely and will be set up as soon as the £ 499 payment has been received.

 
The cost of CGS grading per coin is the greater of £ 15.75 or 2% of the coins value. A payment of £ 15.75 per coin is payable (or deducted from the £499) when the coins are submitted. At the end of the process and before the coins are returned to the submitter any additional fees relating to the 2% valuations becomes payable.
 

If you are looking to have a few coins graded where the total grading fees will be less than £499 you may be able to find an agent who will help you. You will not be able to deal direct with CGS.

"

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Oh wow. So not only are they introducing a fee, they're trying to push people out who don't send more than 30 coins throughout the year..

Not only that but if you then click on 'Find an agent', it tells you this;

 

 

1.png

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That should make it pretty excusive if extended to existing members - approximately 32 coins at lowest price, or just one coin valued at £25K. I presume the 2% fee is based on their own (inflated) valuation. It is certainly going to exclude the casual person slabbing. Given the find an agent link requires you to be logged in and to log in you have to be a member and to become a member you now have to pay £500, I see it all ending in tears. :)  It isn't directed at any TPG in particular, but these membership fees are a huge premium to pay for something that is essentially a hobby. Why try to frighten people away? Or are they trying to emulate the less scrupulous vendors in asking OTT prices for something that isn't realisable.

It's alright asking a premium, but people new to the hobby would expect that extra expenditure to help realise higher prices when the time comes to sell. Unless the TPGs offer a market which trades at higher prices to the real world, it's a case of fools and their money soon parted. I can see a parallel with other selling scandals.

 

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8 minutes ago, Rob said:

Given the find an agent link requires you to be logged in and to log in you have to be a member and to become a member you now have to pay £500..

:D:D

And when you do finally become a member and log in, it tells you that there aren't any agents. 500 quid well spent.

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6 minutes ago, Nordle11 said:

Oh wow. So not only are they introducing a fee, they're trying to push people out who don't send more than 30 coins throughout the year..

Not only that but if you then click on 'Find an agent', it tells you this;

 

 

1.png

Yes, I saw that too, but things are being finalised as we type I think.

My understanding is that it is a one-off payment of £499, not annual, and when that is 'used up' then you have to pay more each batch you send in.

It would actually work out cheaper for me on coins valued between £200-£1100, as they were charging £21.95 each for these.

But paying £500 to have a £25K coin graded seems steep!

I believe also that you will be able to use their site for free once again as a non-member, it will just for be for slabbing that you will need to pay the fee, or 'find an agent' 

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The question remains though, who assigns the value? This is a conflict of interests because remuneration is tied to a value assigned by the recipient of your money. If slabbing has to be done, and I have no reason to deny them the right to offer a service, then it should be a flat fee service. The time taken to grade a £10 coin should be no more or less than that required to do a £10K coin - if the job is done properly. By all means charge higher shipping due to the insurance, but if you are paying more to have a high value coin graded it tells me that either someone is skimping somewhere or alternatively, someone is being ripped off for the time actually taken.

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4 minutes ago, Rob said:

The question remains though, who assigns the value? This is a conflict of interests because remuneration is tied to a value assigned by the recipient of your money. If slabbing has to be done, and I have no reason to deny them the right to offer a service, then it should be a flat fee service. The time taken to grade a £10 coin should be no more or less than that required to do a £10K coin - if the job is done properly. By all means charge higher shipping due to the insurance, but if you are paying more to have a high value coin graded it tells me that either someone is skimping somewhere or alternatively, someone is being ripped off for the time actually taken.

Quite agree - and it will inevitably be based on the value that CGS themselves assign. It should be a flat fee.

Do estate agents do more work when selling a £500k property compared to £250K? I doubt it, but they get paid twice as much!

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Yes, but even the oft maligned estate agents have some competitors offering a fixed fee service. Here we have a (not very cheap) service aimed at presumably the less confident collector. Put another way. Why do so many people buy LMO products? It's a case of marketing a product above its regular market value for a similar item. People think they are getting something that is a good investment and (often unwittingly) pay multiples of market value for that item. Slabbing is surely no different. Each and every one of us say the same thing - buy the coin and not the slab. It's easier to inspect an unslabbed coin, however, it's also easier to let someone give an opinion on grade while you sit back and accept this unquestioningly.

TBH, people who blindly spend tens of thousands on things without due diligence are equally to blame for any value shortfall. Bet they wouldn't buy their car without seeing or sitting in it first. It boils down to greed in all probability just like any other get rich quick scheme.

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Entirely agree - again.

I've been speaking with Bill Pugsley (CGS Forum Chair) about this today to try and make some sense of this as a business model

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Sorry but they have lost the plot completely, £500 for their service, NOOOOO THNAKS

Edited by azda

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