ozjohn

I checked some Australian predecimal coins which contained the DG up to about 1964. but was missing on the 1965 50c rounds. Funny thing is Australia has gone from strength to strength since then.

I looked at our Australian coins you are right the DG has gone. The history of Australian coins is interesting initially we started with a motley collection of coins, British and foreign, called proclamation coins. These included the cartwheel pennies and a coin called a holey dollar which was a Spanish 8 reales with the center punched out and marked 15 pence while the rest of the coin was valued at 5/-. Nothing new about debasing coins! Also beware of forgeries This is considered to be Australia's first coin but in reality the idea of debasing the coin by removing some of the silver in it was an attempt to keep these coins in Australia. I think similar strategies were applied elsewhere in the West Indies.. After the English recoinage English coins were issued and branches of the Royal Mint were setup in Melbourne and Sydney and later in Perth for the production of soveriegns. These mints also issued English coins in the later 1800s for circulation in Australia while earlier the coins were imported directly. English coins continued to circulate in Australia until the 1930s then they migrated back to the UK as the Australian Pound was devalued to 15/- in 1932. In addition Australia issued its own set of coins in 1911. Florin, shilling sixpence, threepence, penny and halfpenny. The fact that English coins were the currency for close to a centaury seems to escape most collectors here in Australia when in truth coins of this period from a historical perspective should form part of any comprehensive Australian collection.

If you do not know about the I in QUI close to the top LHS of the shield on the reverse of the coin it convincing as a genuine 1905 halfcrown.. Buyer beware.

Thanks for all the replies. On the whole they seem to be positive which gives me confidence I have done the right thing in this case. I hasten to add I would not embark on cleaning coins lightly but in this case I think it was the right thing.

I gave the coin some more time in the bicarb of soda/ aluminium foil bath and I am pleased with the result. Most of the heavy toning has gone while the coin still retains good eye appeal. I am pleased with the result. On reflection the bicarb of soda/aluminum foil bath is a fairly gentle process as it does not contain sulfuric acid as many proprietary silver dip preparations do. The process involves removing the sulfur from the silver sulfide (the toning) and converting it back into silver metal and the aluminium in the foil is converted into aluminium sulfide.

Exactly the other coin I showed I think has been over cleaned and it was not the same coin.. Not badly cleaned but it has removed all of the toning. What I am trying to achieve is a compromise. Also one reply notes wear on the ear. That's fine but there is no wear on the eyebrow. I suspect the ear was not struck up initially. As I said previously the milling on the coin is pristine. Of course this is difficult to determine for sure but I think the grading is some where in the MS area,

This is the other end of scale.

Normally I would agree with you trouble is you could not see the coin underneath. One thing it has revealed is the coin's true grading. I have not shown the milling of the coin but it is crisp as the day it was minted and given the difficulty of grading KGV coins this is a very good guide.

I think the finished result is better than the photos. However I think you maybe right about needing more cleaning.

One of the coins I showed under another topic which had been slabbed someone remarked that it had been cleaned. Cleaning is something I would not embark upon myself but if it is done properly well ok. I don't know how the person knew it had been cleaned other than it was very bright with no toning at all. I had another look at the coin and there was no evidence of scratching so probably it had been dipped rather than physically cleaned and the process had been carefully done. The attached jpegs show a 1913 halfcrown with much toning. What do you do with it? Leave as is but you can hardly see the coin or dip it to reveal the coin under all that oxide? Comments please

I always look on the UK ebay.co.uk site and an increasing number of sellers are not shipping to Australia. The mail service between our two countries is good very little is lost while Paypal allows secure transfer of cash what's the problem?

As far as I can see the recent move for Scottish independence started with the crazy idea of Blair's allowing governments for Wales, Scotland and N. Ireland but no government for England except the traditional Westminster UK government . This has lead to differences and distortions over the UK, such as prescription charges, university education charges etc. which have help foster the idea of breaking up the UK. When Australia federated all the potential states agreed to a common constitution that spelt out the responsibilities and powers of the State and Commonwealth governments. In fact this constitution was a bill of the house of commons. As a result the house of commons should have known better when trying to introduce a sort of federal system to the UK when it instituted aState/Local government for each part of the UK ie. England Scotland etc. and should have drawn up a constitution stating the rules of this federal system and how the components react with each other. In any case this wasn't done and the result we can see to day with a referendum for Scotland to leave the UK. Perhaps this was Blair's intention I don't know the best judgment being it wasn't thought out very carefully or at worst a sinister attempt to destabilize the UK. Again coming back to the Australian model the constitution can only be changed by a referendum where there is a majority of States that agree to the proposed change. Perhaps you can argue that the present setup in the UK isn't a federal system however the UK as it stood before the Blair changes was a country governed by a single parliament from which some responsibilities have been devolved to different states in a non consistent way causing a lot of unnecessary grief and uncertainty. In all a very bad idea which all the people in the UK will come to regret. For example if Scotland becomes independent it will probably lose its membership of the EU. Not a bad idea for the whole UK but for a small country like Scotland could be very bad and not at all certain if Spain opposes it and it seems likely they will. There would not be any reason for an open border between England and Scotland. Financial implications are also great. I could go on. The only positive could be a completely new issue of coinage for Scotland but according to many not based on the pound.

I am sorry I re submitted this question as I could not find any record of it my appolgies

Hi Garrett, No I'm a 10 pound pom now a confirmed Australian. I lived and raised my family in Sydney for about 30 years and moved to Brisbane when my wife retired. My only weakness is I like halfcrowns and my excuse is they use to circulate in Australia. Regards, John

Sorry GVF

Went there today. There were some good coins there. A couple of gothic crowns and a holey dollar and dump. I also saw a penny black stamp for $80. Brought a 1829 halfcrown in GVG grade.

London Coins and CGS seem to share the same address. I guess they could be accused of being self slabbers.

I still need to be convinced about slabbing but I have managed to obtain some on the way. Possibly it's the way ahead as internet auction companies such as ebay do not recognize any coins other than professionaly graded coins although they do not seem to apply this at present. I think internet auctions are a powerful force in the coin market and will only grow in influence in future. I already think online auctions have already changed the dymanics of the coin market putting collectors into a more powerful position then they previously held. For example before the event of online auctions the price realized at auction houses was about half the retail price from a dealer this has now changed with sellers getting prices much closer to the retail price by using online auctions. I realize this is a generalization but I think there is a lot of truth in this. Attached are scans coins from 3 grading companies of fairly close grading of the same type of coin and I think the grading results for these examples is close to the mark. Of interest the National Numismatic Certification certified coin (img 178) seems to be well graded despite some posts on these forums which do not rate this company. However recently listed on ebay are some NNC graded coins which are very poorly graded for example an Edward VII halfcrown graded at VF-40 which I do not think would even make the grade of Fine. Hope this adds to the discussion.

Finally obtained a 1911 halfcrown after years of waiting for something decent and at a reasonable price to turn up. I have seen many over the years which look to be UNC on the reverse but the obverse is poor maybe wear or perhaps poorly minted with the top of the ear and side of the head flattened. The florins of that era with the lions on the top shield of the reverse not fully struck are a problem as well. During that time I have managed to acquire too UNC proof halfcrowns of that year.

PGC my abbreviation for a professionally graded coin. Perhaps I should have said slabbed.

The Australian 20 cent. 10 cent and 5 cent coins which are still issued here follow the same size and weight of the imperial coins of England despite Australia changing to decimal currency in 1966. The Australian coins were .500 silver until this date. These coins correspond to the florin. shilling and sixpence respectively. A ,800 fine 50 cent coin was released in 1966 which was very close to the halfcrown in size and weight but was valued at 10/- or 50 cent and was later replaced by a Cu Ni coin. The 20 cent, 10 cent and 5 cent coins which correspond to the florin, shilling and sixpence still exist to this day. It also has to be said that the silver threepence was issued up to decimalization rather than the bronze issue that started in 1937 in the UK..Halfcrowns were never minted by the Royal Australian Mint but circulated in Australia as they were issued here prior to the issue of Australian coins in 1910 and circulated well into the 1920s and 1930s and perhaps later. An interesting series to collect and closely related to the coins of England.

Not sending a British coin to the UK seems strange to me if you are interested in selling the coin in the market that is likely to pay the best price. Also equally annoying when a UK seller does not mail to Australia. However an email sometimes irons out any problems of this type.

PS I would rather had a non PGC but you cannot have everything and the price was ok.

One of the posts in this topic asked for a picture.

The open work shilling you show is part of the first series of Australian coins with Edward VII on the obverse and they were minted by the Royal Mint. I'm no expert on Australian issues but there are some interesting issues like the 1915 (I think) florin where some have an H mint mark for the Heaton mint and one of the 1940s florin has a S mint mark for San Fransisco . Of course gold sovereigns were minted at the Sydney, Melbourne & Perth branches of the Royal Mint. However these coins were not exclusively Australian coins but were part of the imperial mintage. These mints also distributed imperial coins for use in Australia prior to 1910.