[Russ777]

Just to let you know I wrote to the mint some time ago about my Shield 20p with a '1' it looks like there could be something in it being a die number as the Royal Mint museum recently asked me to send it for analysis. I also have one which appears a different colour 'pink tinge' I think I mentioned some time ago where a finishing process may be missing I have sent that one.

Unfortunately I sold the possible Die '1' if anyone has one I think the museum would be very interested to analyse. Or indeed if you are the one I sold it to I can forward a contact address if you contact me here. I may regret having sold the '1' as I think it may be rarer than the mule if it is indeed a die number and not a flaw... I notice you sometimes get a flaw around the MD.

I think someone else was offered £50 for a '1' sometime ago. There seems very few knocking around...

I will let you know the findings as regards the metal finishing one as soon as I get the letter. I think the '1' is more interesting to the museum if we could solve that one!

If the exact metal finishing error is confirmed with a letter from the mint museum would that bestow quite a mark up on value??? As I know finishing errors do not appeal to all collectors.. I was accused of tampering with it buy someone on Ebay when trying to sell, but that is impossible it came in a sealed bag of uncirculated coins and teh only one with the 'pink tinge'

Regards Russ777

[Chris Perkins]

I think it was me that bought the coin with the '1'!

It's probably rarer than the dateless coin, but that could be due to the fact that the dateless one is easy for the layperson to see. There may well be the same amount of '1' coins out there, but no one is looking for them. And, even if they were looking for them, a die number (if that's what it is) is much less spectacular than a mule. Did I not read something somewhere to the effect that the RM also acknowledged the 'number 1' 20p at about the same time as they acknowledged the dateless mule??

I'd be relunctant to send it off though. Did you send them high re pictures of it?

As for the metal mix or finishing of the blanks, instinct tells me that a bad mix etc leading to an odd tone wouldn't really stir up much extra interest. Even with a letter from the mint, it's just a slight flaw leading to a differently toned coin. Worth a couple of quid as an oddity perhaps.

[1949threepence]

Interesting. Not heard of this before.

Whereabouts on the 20p is the "1" ?

[Chris Perkins]

On the reverse at the bottom, right in the middle where the design part meets the blank rim.

See image!

It's a raised '1' which appears to have also caused a die crack running above and below it.

Attached File(s)

•  PB030496.JPG (380.24K)
  Number of downloads: 51

[Flash]

Why is that a "1" and not just some indiscriminate blob?

[Chris Perkins]

It could be an iindiscriminate blob, I don't deny it!

The fact it's raised and also that others have also reported a '1' in that position stacks the evidence slightly against it being a random blob.

I'm sure I read somewhere that someone had been in touch with the RM and that they had admited there were 20p's from the very first batch with a '1' on them! Wish I could find it.

[Peckris]

Don't get too excited about the RM response - their standard reply is to ask to see the coin and put it through whatever analysis they see fit. It really doesn't mean anything at all until you get their reply / results.

[scott]

my theory is they did that AFTER they found the error patch and used it as a check.
BUT there does seem to be some cudding into the detail under the one so maybe its juts a blob

[Russ777]

Peckris, on Nov 2 2009, 11:21 PM, said:

Don't get too excited about the RM response - their standard reply is to ask to see the coin and put it through whatever analysis they see fit. It really doesn't mean anything at all until you get their reply / results.

Hi I have to admit it was me who reported the '1' to the mint. Someone verbally said it had something to do with being the first batch of coins produced but I never got anything firm in writing which I was waiting. I don't think I sold the '1' to you Chris another chap offered one for £50.00 I believe on this site I sold you the mule... I then offered a different one on here but the member was convinced mine was just a die crack. But maybe it is a worn die???

I have seen others without such a prominent '1' in the same position next to MD could it be the die crack appeared around the one once the mould got worn so the 1 would no longer look prominent?

Nothing was ever received in writing, they said my query was lost in the filing!!! about 7 months ago!!

I have also sent them one without the prominent '1' more of a line in the same position so maybe they will clear this up if it was a 1 that has become distorted..

Lets hope my returned coins and reply are returned safely...

Russ777

[Chris Perkins]

It's very difficult to stick a raised number onto a coin after it's been struck! A raised device has to be in negative on the die.

[scott]

but why just the 20p? why is there nothing on the ohter demoninations?

[1949threepence]

Chris Perkins, on Nov 2 2009, 10:35 PM, said:

On the reverse at the bottom, right in the middle where the design part meets the blank rim.

See image!

It's a raised '1' which appears to have also caused a die crack running above and below it.

Thanks Chris.

Very difficult to say what it is, but I'm veering towards die crack, as the "1" appears ever so slightly curved.

[Chris Perkins]

Lets hope others come to light after reading this so we can compare images.

[DaveG38]

I too have one of these so called '1' 20 pences. Attached is a quick scan of mine - apologies, but the quality isn't that good. What you can't see, but is absolutely clear under a glass is that there is a die crack running from the apparent '1' through the design to the point I indicate with the arrow. Also, when you examine the '1' it is obvious that its just an elongated splash of metal and isn't in any way a design feature. The '1' is also in very low relief with weak edges which is what you might expect as a result of a die flaw or crack.

Incidentally, this example also shows the so-called bump on the lion's knee. The mint do seem to have had problems with the 2008 20p don't they?

 Coins_019.jpg (33.42K)
Number of downloads: 29

[Chris Perkins]

Yours is a blob. Mine's definitely a '1'!

[Flash]

The trailing line running off it ruins it for me. Looks like somethings been dribbled on the coin post mint. Have you tried getting your finger nail under any part of it?

[scott]

lots of 2008 coins had random errors, lots of poorly struck 2008 pennies, but blobs of metal on 20p's seems to have happened a lot since 2003, have a fair few 20p's from this period with random raised blobs on the obverse

[Chris Perkins]

It's not something stuck on, definitely something incuse in the die.

[AardHawk]

Its just a bit of swarf that's found its way onto the die during the actual striking process. The "quality assurance" process just failed to pick it up. Probably because they have offshored it to the Bombay mint.